杏MAP导航

By Vatican News

Total trust in God, the awareness of being weak and a sinner, a new call to priests to put themselves at the service of all, his admiration for contemporary martyrs, and his concern for migrants are some of the themes 杏MAP导航 Francis addressed in 2021 in an interview with Noel Díaz at the papal residence of Casa Santa Marta.

Díaz is the founder of lay association 鈥�El sembrador, Nueva Evangelización鈥� (ESNE), which announces the Word of God through television and radio. The previously unaired interview with 杏MAP导航 Francis, originally intended to be part of a documentary, is set to be broadcast by ESNE on Friday.

杏MAP导航 Francis during a 2021 interview with ESNE founder Noel Díaz

Below, please find the English translation of the complete transcript of Noel Díaz鈥檚 interview with 杏MAP导航 Francis:

Q. Today, you are the successor of this man called Simon. What does this Scripture remind you of, Holiness?

杏MAP导航 Francis: So many things! That Jesus calls Simon into the midst of the people, He does not separate him from the people. It was crowded with people, and Jesus preaches, and the people go to listen to Jesus because they are thirsty for the Word of God. And Jesus speaks as one who has authority.

First thing, Jesus always calls His priests from the people, in the midst of the people. If Peter had forgotten his origin, he would have betrayed Jesus鈥� plan, he would have founded an elite. No! The shepherd has to be with the sheep. That is why he is a shepherd.

The second thing: the signs that Jesus does, not only the authority of His Word. In order for them to have confidence in Him, He performs this marvellous miracle, and nobody expected it. Where Jesus is, His strength is felt; and Peter, when he doubts, when he has no strength, he will remember this, the miracle, that the Lord is able to change things.
 

What does Peter do when he sees Jesus do this? He kneels down before Him, he feels nothing, [he feels] humble, he recognises that he is limited, that he is a sinner: 鈥淒epart from me, Lord, for I am a sinner.鈥� And that is where Jesus gets to where He wants to go. Peter鈥檚 way is to be with the people to listen to the Lord, to go out and fish at the Lord鈥檚 command and to work that miracle. The third thing: recognising his littleness, his nothingness, and saying to the Lord: 鈥淒epart from me, for I am a sinner.鈥�

[Jesus says] 鈥淏ecause you are like that, a sinner, because you followed me, I will now make you a fisher of men.鈥� This is the fourth step.

When Jesus anoints him bishop, priest, He anoints him because he is a shepherd. He doesn鈥檛 anoint him to promote him, in order for him to be the head of an office. He doesn鈥檛 anoint him to organise the country politically. No. He anoints him to be a pastor

This is it says to me.

Q. He puts aside the boat鈥�

He leaves everything. No? Everything!

Q. And how do you feel about taking Peter鈥檚 place?

I feel that the Lord accompanies [me], that it is He who chooses. It is He who began this story. He began this in me, He invited me, He accompanied me. And despite my infidelities, [despite the fact] that I am a sinner like Peter, He does not abandon me. So I feel that He cares for me.

Q. How wonderful! The next passage I want to share with you is from the Gospel of Matthew, when the Apostle Peter makes his confession鈥�

Jesus begins with a survey, He wants to listen. And He says, 鈥淲hat do people say about me?鈥� 鈥淭hey say that you are a prophet, that you are John the Baptist, that you rose from the dead.鈥�

After they express what the people say, He says to them: 鈥淏ut you鈥︹�� 鈥� in other words, He challenges them. Jesus addresses us challenging us: 鈥淲hat do you say for yourself? What do you say about me?鈥� It is the dialogue with Jesus. He calls us by name.

And Peter, already showing himself to be their leader, because Jesus had told him the first day, when He changed his name, when He met him: 鈥淵ou are Simon, but you will be called Peter.鈥� He had made him the cornerstone of the group.

And Peter makes this confession of faith, he puts his whole self on the line. Let鈥檚 put ourselves in the scene: saying to a person: 鈥淵ou are not Tom, Dick, or Harry, you are God, the Son of God.鈥� If you say that to someone today, they take you to the madhouse, they say that you鈥檙e wrong in the head. He put his whole self at stake. And Jesus explains why he had the courage to play: 鈥淔or what you said was not revealed to you by any science, but by the Father through His Spirit.鈥�

And then, when He sees Peter took a gamble like this, He confirms it in his name: 鈥淵ou, Simon, son of Jonah, who are a stone, on this rock I will build my Church.鈥� On the fragility of a man who has the solidity of a stone that relies on the word of Jesus. When he turns away from the word of Jesus, he is like any other man, he does not have the solidity of a stone. That is why He chooses him, because he has the solidity of stone. From Him. From Him.

Peter is amazed at what Jesus says to him: 鈥淢y Father has revealed this to you.鈥� And then Jesus says, 鈥淕ood. But know that I am now going to Jerusalem, and bad things await me there. They are going to bring Me to judgment, they are going to kill Me, they are going to crucify Me, but I will rise again.鈥�

Then Peter, who was already feeling a bit like the group鈥檚 鈥渢op dog鈥�, took Him aside, the Gospel says: 鈥淧lease, Lord, not that!鈥� And Jesus, who had praised Peter, who had said to him, 鈥淵ou are the receptacle of my Father鈥檚 revelation,鈥� challenges him. He says to him, 鈥淕et behind Me, Satan.鈥� The worst insult. Why? Because he wanted Him out of the path of the Cross. It鈥檚 the great correction of the first pope, of Peter.

To the 杏MAP导航s, too, if we ever stray from his plan of salvation, Jesus says, 鈥淭hat鈥檚 not my way, that鈥檚 Satan鈥檚 way.鈥� Why? Because we are sinners and we can go astray. History shows us some popes who preferred a different path, but never, never made a mistake in the faith. That鈥檚 true: Never, even if they led a worldly life.

But when [Peter] errs in the faith, He says: 鈥淣o, that is of Satan! The path is the Cross.鈥� That is, my confidence is in the word of Jesus who gives me firmness when He chooses me and who slaps me upside the head when I make a mistake.

Q. It is very difficult, at times, to face the challenges and attacks from the secular world. But I am sure it is more painful to face the attacks from within. And this says: 鈥淵ou are Peter.鈥� You are now the successor of Peter and these forces, even if all these attacks come, the Word of God say, will not prevail鈥�

What forces does it say will not prevail? What does Jesus say?

Q. The forces of evil.

Of evil, of hell! That is, when hope is placed not in the revelation of the Father or in the choice of Jesus, but in other means. In money, for example. 鈥淲e are well off because we have money.鈥� Imagine a priest, a bishop who says: 鈥淥ur Church is doing well, we have lay people who give us money and we are doing well.鈥� Don鈥檛 put your hope there because you鈥檙e going to fall apart. These are the forces of hell. They are not the forces of the Father鈥檚 revelation.

They insulted Jesus, they crucified Him. And if they did it to Him, who am I that they shouldn鈥檛 do it to me? If they treated the Master like that, any of the disciples, anyone. You don鈥檛 need to be 杏MAP导航, let鈥檚 not pretend otherwise. So many martyrs in the Church teach us this.

Q. Today I just want to propose one more Scripture passage in which the Lord confirms, John 21. 鈥淧eter was grieved because He said to him the third time, 鈥楧o you love me?鈥�, and he said to Him, 鈥楲ord, you know everything; you know that I love you.鈥� Jesus said to him, 鈥楩eed my sheep. Truly, truly, I say to you, when you were young, you used to dress yourself and walk wherever you wanted, but when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and another will dress you and carry you where you do not want to go鈥欌�︹��

It was a confirmation and a promise. He had promised Peter when he confessed Him that the gates of hell would not prevail, that he would stand firm as long as he was on the rock. Here he confirms it three times. Peter is grieved because he remembers the three times he denied Him. And at the end the Lord confirms him for the third time. And does He say to him, 鈥淔rom now on nothing bad will happen to you. Now you will have all the power, now you will have all the money, now the people will follow you鈥�? Does He tell him that? No! He tells him: 鈥淕o on, because when you are old you will go where you don鈥檛 want to go, they will take you where you don鈥檛 want to go, they will strip you and you will end up like Me, crucified鈥�. The Lord promises Peter His own way, the way of the Cross, the way of total surrender, the way of putting one鈥檚 trust in Him alone.

It鈥檚 interesting just as when Peter confessed that Jesus was the Son of God 鈥� the power of the Holy Spirit makes him confess that 鈥� he then loses his bearings, and when Jesus talks about the Cross, he tries to convince Him otherwise. Peter, who falls into worldly thinking. And here it鈥檚 the same thing. Jesus tells him that, he accepts, [Peter] turns around and sees John. Then: 鈥淎h Lord, now that he鈥檚 here, what鈥檚 going to happen to this one?鈥� It is the gossiping Peter, the Peter who forgets at that moment what the Lord had spoken to him in order to have a gossip about someone else.

We are like that, but the Lord takes care of us with His power, even when we have to go to martyrdom, He accompanies us with His hand.

And speaking of martyrdom, I would like to finish by talking about today鈥檚 martyrs. There are more martyrs today than at the beginning of the Church. Christian martyrs, martyrs whose heads are cut off just because they are Christians and they confess Jesus. Martyrs who are in prison for confessing Jesus. They are our brothers!

It is the Church of the martyrs. This is the Church that triumphs, not the Church with money in the banks.

This is the Church that triumphs, the Church of martyrs, the Church of witness. Because martyrdom means 鈥渨itness.鈥� I mentioned those who give their lives, but that man, that woman who works every day to educate their children in the Christian life and give them testimony, is also a martyr. 鈥淣o, Father, he鈥檚 not a martyr if they didn鈥檛 kill him鈥� [someone might say]. No, martyr means witness! Martyrdom is witness, that鈥檚 the translation of the Greek word. Any witness to Jesus is a martyr, that is to say, is a martyr, he bears witness. And that carries forward the Church as well.

God bless you all and pray for me, please.

And to all of you who are watching, listening to this conversation, may the Lord open your hearts and may His Word enter in there. So I bless you from the bottom of my heart. I bless you. I give you my blessing as a father, as an elder brother, as a servant of all of you. May Almighty God bless you, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. And please pray for me. Thank you.

Q. This represents the migrants, whom I told I would ask for your blessing.

Thinking of the migrants, those who have had to leave their homeland, who are welcomed by so many good people or even indifferent people, who are on the road of exile, far from their homeland, longing for friends, family, the beauty of their homeland. To all migrants I give my blessing in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.